No Confidence is the 26th episode of The Chain. It aired on August 28th, 2019.

King reports back to The Sapphire Sky. Meanwhile, Boots meets with a new friend?  Later, King discusses the future of The Chain with the Senior Officers.  Back in Ringwell once again, The Chain of Acheron free Lady Violentia. She returns the favor with information about the Keys to access the depths of Ringwell.


When last we left our heroes, Boots -- AKA Deo Bertone -- had been invited to a meeting of the Bookbinder’s Club, to be held that night, the invitation to which had been delivered to the sausage shop. Interestingly, none of the employees of the sausage shop are members of The Chain, which means someone’s intelligence is excellent to have ferreted out that the store is a front and whose front it is. And also, King received a message from Angel via the diplomat’s pouch saying that ‘the college kid’ wanted to meet up.

The Cup of Blood[]

When Marcellus Scipio sees King enter the Dancing Minstrel, he tells King, “We need to talk, but not here.”

“Sure, lead the way.” 

A Dragon, Out of Time[]

Marcellus Scipio leads him to a carpet, which ultimately takes them to a much nicer tavern which Marcellus refers to as ‘The Cup of Blood’ but the sign outside of said tavern says “the Wine Chalice”. Scipio tells King that he believes the problem of Lady Orozivaar has been solved by the moon elf. He’s not entirely sure exactly what happened, but he petitioned the Pale Light for help and Lady Orozivaar was gone.

King wants to know what he means, gone. Scipio says he’s not sure, but he thinks Pale Light moved Lady Orozivaar through time, maybe for weeks, maybe months. They don’t know how far ahead, but Lady Orozivaar will come back. Scipio says he wants King to know that he thinks they did the right thing by not just eliminating Lady Orozivaar, but that bringing her to the Sapphire Sky wasn’t the best next course. That’s not really their purpose. They’re dedicated to eradicating evil, no matter where it’s found, so they couldn’t countenance doing evil to protect The Chain.

Scipio tells King to be careful not to tell Vile Silencer too much and that they need to not bring a problem like Lady Orozivaar again. 

Breaking Down Barriers[]

Scipio asks how it’s going in Ringwell. King catches him up on the most recent developments in Ringwell, including the viral autophage and the Cauldron of Xorronon [sp]. King gives Marcellus Scipio a copy of the map and says that the floor they’ve explored seems to be primarily have been used to store items of great evil.

King tells him they’re currently blocked from further access to Ringwell. Lady Violentia, currently trapped in the godblind, appears to be their only lead for getting further into Ringwell. He says as far as they know, the only way to free her is to either gather several gemstone dragonborn together or to use Slim’s stone to bring the wall down.

Scipio says he’ll talk to the Vile Silencer to see if they can find a replacement for Slim’s crystal so they can be free to let Lady Violentia out of her trap, in the hopes that she’ll tell them the way into Ringwell. Scipio orders food, then asks King, “Let me ask you a personal question. Why did you join The Chain? You could have killed Lady Orozivaar and I’m going to guess, based on what I know of the senior command of The Chain, at least one of them must have lobbied to take the easy path and silence her forever, and you said no. Why does somebody like that join The Chain? If you don’t want to talk about it, I understand.”

King says, “No, it’s okay. I didn’t have a home to go back to. I met a senior officer of The Chain and he showed me that even when there’s no home to go back to, you can make one. He eventually became the Commander of The Chain.”

Scipio wants to know, “Why couldn’t you go home? No, never mind. That’s none of my business. I’ve vouched for you and now, having seen some of you, if you ever need somewhere to go, come to me.”

They discuss how best The Chain can use what they find in Ringwell and Scipio says, “You’re looking for ways to stop Ajax. It’s not my place to tell you your business, but perhaps you should leave what’s good to us.” The subtext is that they should keep what’s evil to use in their quest.

They part ways, with Scipio agreeing to try to find a replacement for Slim’s crystal. He’s pretty confident that, with the resources of the Vile Silencer and the Sky, that they’ll be able to find something that makes everyone happy.

The Bookbinder's Club[]

Boots had received a cryptic invitation to the Bookbinder’s Club. At the Dancing Minstrel, he learns where the Bookbinder’s Club is located in a very posh part of town (called Castor Gate?). Boots recalls that the Bookbinder’s Club, while not famous, is known to be a gentlemen's club. It’s a place where rich Riojan nobles go to hang out. 

Boots changes into his fancy clothing in preparation for his date and uses prestidigitation to make himself even more presentable. Boots chooses to take a coach, so he arrives looking very fashionable. As he exits the coach, he sees an old, tall multistory building with an open book on the sign.  It’s well lit inside, with warm light coming through the frosted glass. He can see people moving inside.

Boots approaches the door and knocks, which opens immediately. A butler or majordomo opens the door and says, “Sir?”

Boots presents his invitation.

“Ah, this way, sir.”

Lord Latimer, of the Actian School[]

He leads Boots through rooms filled with nobles. There are quite a lot of knick knacks from all over the world decorating the rooms, remnants of empire. There are noblemen walking around, having after dinner tea, talking to each other.  There’s a thick layer of smoke hanging over the whole place. The servant leads Boots to a small table, almost a coffee table, in a nook separate from everyone else. He says, “Lord Latimer will be with you shortly. Would you like something to drink?”

Boots orders a coffee, and in short order a slim noble with white hair approaches. As he’s about to sit with Boots, someone approaches him, “Lord Latimer.” Lord Latimer makes his excuses to the noble and plans to speak with him later, then sits down with Boots.

They exchange introductions. Boots is curious as to how and why Lord Latimer caused the invitation to be delivered. Lord Latimer offers compliments for Angel, who is quite good at what he does, but not quite as good as their organization. He says, “We know you’re working on something. We know it’s big, and we want to help.”

Boots says, “Yeah? Go on.”

Latimer says, “We’re lacking on details, but we’re fairly certain you’re working to stop Ajax. You don’t seem terribly concerned about what happens to Capital, but if there’s any way for us to help, we wish to help. We lack specifics, but if there’s something my organization to do to help you, that would be a wonderful opportunity to trade favors.”

Boots asks for and receives a cigar from the servant, and relaxes into his chair to continue the conversation. Latimer says, “My organization has quite a lot of resources in the city and if there’s anything we can do, we’re here to help.”

Boots says, “I’ve been out of the city for a while. What, exactly, is it your organization does?’

“Oh, how rude of me.” Latimer takes a card out of a silver case and hands it to Boots. It says, “Lord Latimer, City Manager, Actian School.”

Cards on the Table[]

Latimer says something about their interests overlapping and Boots agrees. Boots suggests that there is a problem with there not being any unified military forces in the city.

Latimer agrees and enumerates the forces The Chain has at their disposal. Boots says they’re not politicians and perhaps that hinders them somewhat, but that may change. He tells Latimer that they’re concerned that when Ajax arrives, if there’s no unified force to oppose him and if the city is fighting against itself, things might go badly, but that if the city had been unified -- perhaps behind a prince -- the odds might be more in their favor.”

Latimer asks if Boots has any ideas who might be eligible for such a position. Boots takes his own card out of a silver case and slides it over to Latimer, making a small joke.

Latimer asks what they’re doing in Collinsgate. Boots says they’re doing a bit of excavation. Latimer assumes, “Ah, into the Layers.” Then he wants to know, “If Ajax were to arrive here, and given the current situation in Capital, who would The Chain back?”

Boots prevaricates a bit, saying that they haven’t had audiences with all of the players in the city. Latimer mentions their meeting with Lady Shirome and the Twelve Dragons. Boots says that was a nice refresher. Latimer says that these political waters must be rough seas for mercenaries. Boots agrees, then says that not only do they lack knowledge about the political players, but that it doesn’t really matter much to them who is ultimately in charge, as long as someone is.

Latimer offers Boots a literal blank check, saying that if there’s anything they can do to help, he hopes The Chain will come to them. 

Latimer asks about Boots’ family. Boots asks if Latimer knows about the current whereabouts of Boots’ father or family. Latimer says they don’t, but he imagines that would be fairly simple to discover. Boots mentions that he’s been out of the city for a while and it would be useful to know what happened to his family.

Latimer wants to know what kind of outcome Boots hopes for. Boots says they’ve been looking for any unclaimed strongholds or lands in the city. Latimer says it can be difficult to come by those things without making enemies. Boots says, “We find it easier to deal with enemies than with real estate.”

Boots asks, “If you were to choose someone to be the prince, who and why?”

Latimer says, “Tricky to say. If I had my own way, I’d want the old prince back, but if I were a betting man, I’d bet on House Alvaro.”

Boots asks, “Why?”

Latimer replies, “Well, because I think we’ll win.”

Boots asks, “Would you say that, in your estimation, the military force of House Alvaro is the strongest among the Houses in Capital?”

Latimer replies that they frequently run war games and that they’ve found that a single house is seldom powerful enough to win, but via alliances they can put together a world beater. It all depends on how the game plays out.

Boots agrees. 

A Purely Hypothetical Takeover of the Pellet[]

Latimer asks, “This digging operation you’re mounting in Collinsgate, am I safe to assume that it furthers your goal of pursuing Ajax’s wizard?

Boots says, “In a way, yes. It should provide us allies and tools to help us carry out this job.”

Latimer asks, “Is there any way we can help?”

Boots says, “I’m sure there is. Again, Lord Latimer, you’ll have to forgive me. I’m rusty at politics. In the hypothetical situation where you were to have a military force to move into an unclaimed part of the city, what would the ramifications of that be?”

Lord Latimer says, “That’s not an unknown situation here.”

They discuss the Twelve Dragons attempted takeover of the Pellet, then Latimer says, “I imagine the answer to your question would depend on who tried to take over said unclaimed territory and what their alliances were.” Lord Latimer intimates that they would turn a blind eye towards The Chain if they were to take over a territory if they were allied with House Alvaro, but if they thought The Chain was allied with, for instance, Lady Shirome, they might expect some pushback.

A Name-Check[]

Boots tells him that this is an apolitical third party they’re undertaking the project in the Collinsgate for, which Latimer doubts, calling the idea of an apolitical third party something of a unicorn. Latimer tries to dig for more information about who this third party might be. He asks if they’re trying to fulfill a contract or engaging in this digging operation for themselves.

Boots says that it might be a bit of both, but that they’re playing things close to the chest. Latimer says that they might be inclined to turn a blind eye to what The Chain is after if The Chain is frank with them and says, for instance, if they were to divulge the name of what they’re digging after.

Boots is reluctant to say much, but that they call upon them at need. Latimer says that he’d hoped to come to some understanding among gentlemen. Boots notes that he’s literally been given a blank check and says that some reciprocation is probably appropriate. Boots asks if Latimer has heard of the Sapphire Sky and says, “That’s the name of our unicorn.”

Latimer says that the Sapphire Sky’s goals must align with The Chain’s. Boots says that they do for the most part at the moment, but that it’s more about some people not being interested in sullying their hands with things that The Chain might be more willing to do.

Latimer says a lot of words that boil down to he understands that The Chain might be willing to go a bit beyond the letter in order to fulfill their prior contract to eliminate Ajax’s  wizard and that he hopes they will be able to be of some service to The Chain in the future.

Regrouping at the Dancing Minstrel[]

The rest of The Chain went back to the Dancing Minstrel while King and Boots kept their dates and everyone spends the night. Boots slaps down the black check on the table where the rest of the senior officers are sitting and says, “Anyone want to buy this district?” Boots explains that it came from Lord Latimer, member of House Alvaro and what happened during his meeting with Lord Latimer.

Slim takes the check and looks at it. To his eyes, it looks like a very short contract. Slims clarifies, “You can write in any number you want.” Boots agrees. Slim says, “What kind of lascivious act did you have to do to get this?”

Boots explains that Latimer wants them to cause the war that ultimately they’ll use to put a new prince on the throne.

The morning broadsheets says, “Twelve Dragons refuse to vacate City Building; Red Falcons surround them.”

Lady Antonia is quoted in the article saying that the Twelve Dragons have no authority in the Pellet and that if need be, the Red Falcons will evict them.

Boots suggests that they might be able to help Lady Antonia by siccing Lord de Corano on the Twelve Dragons. 

A Gift for a Gith[]

A package is delivered to King. It’s wrapped in butcher’s paper, tied with twine. It says, “From Marcellus.” 

Slim says, “Why would we do that? We don’t owe the Red Falcons anything.”

While they discuss what, if anything, they’re going to do about the Twelve Dragons, King opens the package and finds inside some silver bracers of Gith origin that would do approximately what Slim’s crystal does. The “Silver Bands of Vlaakith”. He hands them to Slim and says, “We can keep those if we use the psionic crystal to take down the barrier and free Lady Violentia.” Slim says, “It’s really up to you. You gave me the crystal to use. If you want to use it to free Lady Violentia, then that’s what we’ll do.” Slim hands the crystal back to King in exchange for the bracers. 

Boots says if they could leverage his new relationship with Lord Latimer to encourage de Corano to get the Twelve Dragons out, they might be able to take it over as their stronghold in Capital. King initially thinks they’re better off staying close to the entrance they found to Ringwell, but then starts thinking about how defensible the Library is and the wealth of information available there -- and that it would hinder Lady Shirome’s ability to access the information within. 

Act Like the Prince's Men[]

Leech asks King about his meeting with Marcellus. King starts to explain their discussion, then says they shouldn’t talk about it here. Zorj and his lieutenant walk into the Dancing Minstrel. Zorj looks around the common room, sees their table, then walks over with his lieutenant behind him. He says, “The Chain of Acheron, lately decamped from The Stays and now staying in our district. How lucky for us. Killed that dragon though. Did they have to do that?” 

His lieutenant says, “Sir, no they did not.”

“No they did not. And stopped that FUNGUS was eatin’ everyone, stayed to help clean up. What do you make of that?”

“Very civic minded, I’d say sir.”

“Very civic minded indeed. But your men, five of your men, get drunk and in a fight with some boys from House Alvaro. [he spits] Eh, I take ‘em down to the jail, give ‘em a slap on the wrist and LET ‘EM GO! A favor! Between the Prince’s Men! But who’s men are you really?”

He says that Lady Antonia seems to be a very good judge of character, but, “Hey! Don’t look at him, look at me! I’m the law here! Law is the only thing keeping this city together. Seems to me like we need some kinda...agreement, if you’re going to set up SHOP in my district. You wear the Prince’s symbol and you need to do the job, same as we do. Do you intend to stay, helping to clean up, enforcing the law?”

King says, “Sure, we can spare some men for that. We’ve been cleaning up where we’re staying.”

The senior officers say their men who were disturbing the peace will be disciplined. Zorj says if they want to stay, they’re doing to have to do the work. They carry the Prince’s seal, which isn’t just a pretty ornament.

King asks what he wants them to do. Zorj starts listing off problems that have happened within the city: break-ins, theft, murder. 

Leech suggests they attach the five rankers who disturbed the peace to Zorj's unit. They’ll provide community service as their punishment. Zorj verifies that they have six seals of the Prince and says he wants six members of The Chain for his force. 

Death Knight's Demands[]

The doors to the Dancing Minstrel and a dark and evil presence enters the room. Her boots leave burned, smouldering marks on the wood floor as she walks in and approaches Zorj. She’s wearing black armor, with a black cloak over it, and is dressed as a chivalric knight. Her face shows eons of decay. There’s black smoke slowly emanating off her her shoulders. She walks up to Zorj, who recoils. People in the inn start filing out.

The death knight says to Zorj, in a hollow voice that sounds like it’s coming from a great distance, echoing from a mausoleum, “There is an item here in the city, in your district. My lady demands it.”

Zorj turns to Spindthrift and says, “Do you have any idea what she’s talking about?”

A rod. This long. Black and gold. A hawk’s head atop it. Find this thing, deliver it to me, and live. You have one day,” she says.

Zorj looks at her and says, “You don’t come into MY city like you’re the prince himself. Who are you? And who is your master?”

She walks toward the door, then turns back and says, “You have one day, dwarf, or I will burn out your brain.” After delivering this threat, she dissolves into black smoke.

Zorj and The Chain bicker a bit about the appearance of this death knight and who she was, then he tells them where the police station is and King says they’ll have the rankers report to him for community service. Zorj leaves and The Chain decide to go to the candle shop where they can discuss what just happened confidentially.

No Confidence[]

They enter the candle shop clandestinely and King says, “I made the call on Lady Orozivaar. I wasn’t okay with the idea of just killing her. She hadn’t done anything wrong. I mean, I didn’t like her, but that’s not… I have a hard time seeing the rod of Count von Glauer as just a tool. I think it’s dangerous. It’s dangerous to us. That disease, whatever it is, is dangerous to everybody, innocent people, and it should be destroyed. Maybe we need things like that to fight Ajax. Probably we do, but if it’s up to me, that’s not how we do things. That’s not how we win. So maybe it shouldn’t be up to me.  The Chain needs to be able to do what’s necessary. Forget what I think. And I’m not the Commander. I guess I’m not by any means necessary, so according to the by-laws of the company, I’m calling for a vote of no confidence. According to the Chronicle, it requires a majority of the senior officers to vote no confidence, and the Commander doesn’t get a vote. That leaves four senior officers, which is not enough for a quorum, so Leech, you’re promoted to senior. Welcome to the command structure of The Chain.” 

Angel, who was in the candle shop when they arrived, says, “I think I’d better go.”

They debate a bit about what to do with evil artifacts, if finding these items causes conflict with, for instance, the undead organization. Slim wants to know what King would do if a new commander ordered him to kill Lady Orozivaar. King says, “I think I’ve already answered that. I’d let her go. I don’t think it would be right for The Chain because we’d make enemies of the next largest organization in the city. The Chain is my family and I will do what is best for The Chain.”

Judge thinks they need a commander who can ride the line in the middle and votes no confidence.

Boots votes no confidence. Copper votes for confidence. He feels that King provides a necessary balance to keep The Chain from going too dark. Slim says The Chain is a mercenary company and the survival and well being of the company should come before any sentimental feelings. He votes no confidence. Leech abstains from voting, since the decision had already been reached. He says, “Commander, it’s been a pleasure to serve under you.”

Now they have to choose a new commander. King nominates Slim. Slim says, “I will be a magnificent commander and lead you all to battle!”

Judge nominates Boots. "In the name of diplomacy, considering they’re in Capital..." Slim interrupts, “Boots spilled the beans! He’s got diarrhea of the mouth!”

"...and that this is his home town and he is more familiar with the politics, his knowledge is useful."

Leech seconds the nomination for Boots. Copper seconds the nomination for Slim.

Slim says, “I’m new here. I would like to see what Judge can do,” declining the nomination. The nomination is then down to Judge vs Boots. The chronicle says that a vote for a new commander must be done by a secret ballot.

The Book of Judge[]

The result of the voting is that Judge is the new commander of The Chain of Acheron. 

Judge continues Boots as the lieutenant. Leech tells Odie to celebrate Judge’s ascension to commander, so he dances around Judge’s shoulders, “All hail the new commander.” Then he goes back to Leech and says, “Judge is going to kill you. He’s always hated you.” 

Slim says to Judge, “Do not disappoint us.”

King says, “Commander, what are you orders?”

Judge says he believes they should still go release the woman wearing the guise of Lady Violentia. Leech asks Odie what happened when he went to poke the contents of the cauldron. Odie whimpers, “Eyes, teeth, AH!” Leech says, “You were terrified?” Odie confirms that he was.

Judge asks King about what happened with Marcellus Scipio. Gives her more information about that meeting and that Scipio said they need more lore and that The Chain should not rely upon them to take care of problems like Lady Orozivaar. 

They ask Leech what happened to the worm they took from the autophage. He brings out the vial and they see that the worm itself appears to be dead, but there is still a floating mote in there, which was the precursor to the formation of the worms. They talk about telling the Sapphire Sky about the autophage and decide against it. King wants them to take it back to Ringwell, the only safe place to hold it, but Judge says other people are coming for Ringwell and they don’t want anyone else to have it. King says, “I’d be more comfortable with it in the bag of holding than with Leech.”

Judge asks King to bring Angel back. King sends him a note in the diplomat’s pouch. Angel comes back quickly, smoking. Judge informs him about the change in command and that Boots will continue as lieutenant and asks him to take the news back to the company. Judge musters the senior officers to go back to the godblind and use the psionic crystal to free the woman trapped there.

Lady Violentia, Finally Free[]

Because the woman in the godblind has already lied to them about who she is, Judge suggests they take precautions before letting her go. Copper and Boots block the exits. Once they have their assignments, everyone enters the godblind. When they walk in, she stands up. Slim says, “Be prepared to move out of the circle. I don’t know how long the wall will stay down.” She says, “Ah. I wondered when this would happen. What can I do for you, Commander?”

Judge explains that they have a crystal that should free her and they need her to be ready to move. Judge says, “I believe we had an agreement that upon your release we would talk about where you are from and how to get through the door.”

She replies, “I recall telling you that I’d help you get through the door, but I don’t believe we discussed me telling you where I was from, but we do have interests that align.”

Slim steps up and says to the woman, “If you betray us, I will gut you.”

She says, “I believe you would.”

Slim activates the crystal, which glows. It wreaths his sword in energy. As the crystal glows more brightly, the wall goes down. When the wall disappears, the light in the crystal goes out and Lady Violentia steps out. The ward in the floor fizzles out and turns dull, so that it’s almost impossible to tell that it’s there.

Lady Violentia bows and says, “I am in your debt. What do you want to talk about?”

Boots takes a water skin out of his pack and offers it to Lady Violentia. She says, “I think the charade of me pretending to be human is no longer necessary. What do you want to talk about?”

Seize the Keys![]

Judge asks how to get through the door without a wish. She says that the Emperor gave all of the heads of the Houses a key. She says she believes the Houses are still in possession of keys, but that they don’t know what they have. She says the keys are probably locked away with a bunch of curios and should be trivial to steal for the greatest thief in the world.

Leech asks if she’s the greatest thief in the world. She says, “Modesty prevents me from saying. Say better that I am the cause of thievery in others.” She leads them to the door and explains how the door works. The key will turn off the seal to allow them to pass through the door. “All you have to do is decide whose house to burgle.”

Next Steps for the Lady[]

Judge asks, “So what happens to you now? Do you go back to the Black Iron Pact to join their ranks again as an infiltrator?”

Boots says, “Or you join The Chain!”

She replies, “For me it’s back to business. I think my relationship with the Black Iron Pact is at an end, but I imagine yours is not. I’ll give you one more piece of information out of the goodness of my… what do they call it?... heart. The Black Iron Pact operates out of their own manifold, which can be accessed through one of their rings.”

Boots asks how you access the manifold with one of the rings. She explains how it works. 

Leech asks why she infiltrated the Blackiron Pact. She says, “Leech, let’s be professional. I wouldn’t ask you why you joined The Chain of Acheron. That’s personal.”

Slim asks, if she’s so in with thieves, if she can get them a key. She says that most people try very hard not to do business with her, and that she’s sure that they have some quite good thieves in their employ, but if they try and fail they can talk to her. She has a diplomat’s pouch they can use to get in touch with her.

They take their leave of each other as she says, “Normally when the head of an organization is indisposed, there is a war of succession. I need to go.”

New Directions for the Chain[]

They spend some time deciding if they want the key enough to steal one -- they do. Next they discuss which House they’d want to burgle. They realize that if the Emperor gave keys to all of the great houses of his time, there may be more keys out there in the possession of descendants after their houses collapsed. They discuss going to the Library to find out who those families might have been.

King brings up that there’s one other problem, regarding the rod of Count von Glauer. They discuss a couple of plans about how to save Zorj without necessarily giving up the rod. Boots suggests that they might be able to lure the death knight into the god blind and trap her in the same place Lady Violentia was. King points out, “She named Zorj and threatened his life. If you do this, he’ll be in our debt. It might be to our advantage to have him in our debt and to unify two factions of the Prince’s men.”

Behind the Scenes[]

When originally nominated as the new commander, Slim responded enthusiastically, claiming that he'd lead the Chain to glory. However, Phil said during the discussion that followed that he didn't actually want to be the commander and chose to play Slim specifically to avoid that responsibility, but he felt that Slim wouldn't ever turn aside an opportunity for leadership. Matt stated in the episode's campaign diary that he felt this was because Phil already operates as a leader in his position as studio head at Turtle Rock Studios and that Phil would prefer not to take on the stresses of leadership in his leisure time as well. Slim's eventual decision to recuse himself from consideration based on how new he is to the Chain is a way to play the character in a way that's both plausible and aligns with the player's wishes. This is a form of roleplaying that Matt has previously discussed in his Running the Game series that allows players to avoid forcing themselves to play in a way they don't want or that hurts the fun of the other players due to an overly-strict interpretation of how "the character should act".

The Chronicle's procedure for election of a new commander by secret ballot was decided by the consensus of the viewers at the time of the stream. Similarly, if the vote resulted in a tie, the viewers also decided by consensus that the tie would be broken by a vote by the junoir officers (controlled by the viewers, instead of Matt).